[OPLINTECH] Open Office Software

[Matt Hoffman]

I know this is a bit off-topic, but I think this is an opportune time to
mention how we, as IT people and technology trainers, etc., really ought
not to be looking at software in the light of "we're going to have to
train the staff/public on how to use this program versus this program."
If we in general were doing a better job of teaching technology
literacy, instead of teaching to a program, we'd find (most likely) that
we wouldn't have to have these discussions.  It would be no sweat for
someone to switch from MS Office to Open Office.  They are highly
similar products, and as such, it really shouldn't be a big deal for any
staff member to switch with only a modicum of adjustment.  Also,
teaching technology literacy ought to reduce the fear factor many people
have.

That being said, and not being a trainer myself, I have no idea how one
would really go about such a thing.  Still, I think it's a worthwhile
discussion.

           Matt Hoffman, Network Administrator
Cleveland Heights - University Heights  Public Library
    (voice) 216-932-3600 x 284 (fax) 216-932-0932
 mhoffman at heightslibrary.org www.heightslibrary.org


-----Original Message-----
From: oplintech-bounces at oplin.org [mailto:oplintech-bounces at oplin.org]
On Behalf Of Travis McAfee
Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2008 9:35 AM
To: oplintech at oplin.org
Subject: Re: [OPLINTECH] Open Office Software


This isn't a direct response to Chad or James or Ed.  It is instead just
a 
general thought I have about OO and MS Office.

The cost of Office 2007 Professional  for a library should be somewhere
in 
the ballpark of $55 if you buy it from a source other than your hardware

vendor.  I see a lot of libraries simply paying too much for Microsoft 
Programs.  When a library sends me a quote to check out for them, that's

always the first thing I look at. Usually looking at the quote is
followed 
up with, "Why don't we buy Office from Educational Resources with the 
Purchase Power Agreement instead."

With that said, it's a fairly simple and inexpensive way to put a piece
of 
software on a patron (or staff) machine that will make users comfortable
(if 
that's what they want). On patron machines, I would venture that a $55 
dollar investment in software, coupled with a free download of OOo would

probably reduce staff involvement enough to pay for the cost of the
license.

I'm not trying to sell Microsoft products- I'd venture putting Office
2007 
on the same computer with OOo would eventually drive people to use the
Open 
Source solution.  However, I don't think for the time being it has to be
one 
or the other.

Trav

Travis McAfee
Technology Coordinator, NORWELD
mcafeetr at wcnet.org
419.352.2903
800.848.0144

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mann, James H." <JMann at gcpl.lib.oh.us>
To: "Ed Liddle" <eliddle at marysvillelib.org>; <masontj at manasst.com>
Cc: "Chad Neeper (list)" <cneeper at level9networks.com>;
<oplintech at oplin.org>
Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2008 9:05 AM
Subject: Re: [OPLINTECH] Open Office Software


> Ed
> You're young and may have never heard of "techno stress" LOL. IMHO if 
> you have staff who wants to use OOo, Office 2007, or Macs for that 
> matter go for it. If you want to offer patrons an open source cd so 
> they can breathe more life into their older home computers....bless 
> you. But I'd be a little cautious about unwinding 11 years of techno 
> stress on the part of the public service staff by moving away from 
> Microsoft. This isn't to say that you couldn't do a series of programs

> to retrain your staff but than again, and I think that it's what Tom 
> is saying, is that you're into the "free like free kittens" paradigm.
>
> BTW: Have I ever shared the true and expensive story of $100 Kitty?
>
>
>
>
> Jim Mann
>
> Technology Coordinator
>
> Greene County Public Library
>
> Xenia Ohio 45385
>
> (937)352-4000 x1210
>
> mailto: jmann at gcpl.lib.oh.us
>
> Humor is always based on a modicum of truth Have you ever heard a joke

> about a father-in-law? -- Dick Clark
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: oplintech-bounces at oplin.org [mailto:oplintech-bounces at oplin.org]
> On Behalf Of Ed Liddle
> Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2008 8:53 AM
> To: masontj at manasst.com
> Cc: 'Chad Neeper (list)'; oplintech at oplin.org
> Subject: Re: [OPLINTECH] Open Office Software
>
> What is the cost of retraining staff to use office 2007 vs OOo or heck

> even retraining staff to use vista vs linux vs mac instead of windows 
> xp?  How much time will be taken up from answering questions from 
> patrons about using office 2007 vs using OOo ? That would be just as 
> interesting for me to look at. Reference librarians get paid on an 
> hourly basis to answer questions. It is after all part of their job. I

> am not sure what difference the questions make. Some questions are 
> easy to answer, some are harder. I don't see where the cost spent on 
> answering office application questions is any different than other 
> questions.
>
> I tend to think that something as common as an office suite should not

> require much cost to train someone how to use it if they have used 
> other office suites and are familiar with how to use a computer, 
> access the internet etc. If you decide to use a different office suite

> do you enroll in training classes at a place like new horizons or a 
> class at your local community college to learn how to use it? I 
> personally just start using it, exploring where everything is in the 
> menus and use the help menu or online help I find from using google to

> do what I need to get done.
>
> For library patrons who have never touched a computer or an office 
> suite the "training" would be the same regardless which office suite 
> they use. Personally I think it would be more beneficial to train a 
> patron to use something that they could obtain for free to use at home

> on their PC rather than teach them how to use something they may not 
> be able to afford for their PC at home, or may obtain illegally to use

> on their home computer.
>
> -Ed Liddle
>
> On Tue, 2008-01-22 at 20:30 -0500, Tom Mason wrote:
>> To further add a business slant, does someone have a cost
> justification
>> spreadsheet comparing the 5 year rotational cost of MS office versus
> the
>> support cost of OO?  We change our customer's version of Office when
> they
>> demand it or every 4-5 years.  At $60 AE cost per PC, that's $12-15
> per PC
>> per year.  That's also a high cost compared to larger volume 
>> purchases
> such
>> as Cleveland Public may make.
>>
>> I don't know the Open Office compatibility well, but I assume it 
>> works
> well
>> from Chad's comments.
>> All schools train students on MS Office use currently and most
> businesses
>> use MS Office(95%?). I'm just trying to figure out why and how the
> library
>> can pay someone to re-train the staff, patrons, students who need 
>> Word because of teacher's requirements, etc, for the less than $15 it

>> costs
> per
>> year per pc or less for education/library customers.
>>
>> I don't think there is a justification for the time spent making the
> change,
>> answering questions about versions, compatibility and so on, so I'd
> like to
>> see the cost/benefit analysis that someone has done that includes
> Reference
>> staff time, support staff time, consultant time, and user irritation
> time
>> (with having to do something new).  Based on past experience, I would

>> anticipate an average of 60 min staff/support per day per 20 pc's,
> answering
>> questions, retraining new staff, explaining to staff and patrons, 
>> etc.
> 20
>> pc's cost is $300 per year for licenses for MS Office.  A librarian 
>> is conservatively $50k cost per year with benefits.  1 hour is 
>> roughly
> $24 x 52
>> = $1250/year versus $300 MS office Cost.
>>
>> Is this a good subject for study, for techs to know about and 
>> continue watching? Of course.  However, the extra costs may be better

>> spent on
> books
>> or new PC's, more bandwidth or fulfilling more user requests.  No
> survey
>> I've seen says the public is demanding OO vs MS Office.
>>
>> Btw We don't sell MS Office or MS software to libraries other than 
>> the
> XP
>> OEM we put on the new custom computers we build.  We've been
> supporting
>> libraries for over 15 years in multiple states.
>>
>> As Chad says "fwiw".
>>
>> Thomas Mason, MCSE, AANG, Sr. Consultant
>> Management Assistance, Inc.
>> Manufacturing, Academic and Government Solutions
>> "We make it happen for you!"
>> masontj at manasst.com 440.355.6962 Fax:440-355-4355
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: oplintech-bounces at oplin.org 
>> [mailto:oplintech-bounces at oplin.org]
> On
>> Behalf Of Chad Neeper (list)
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 2:39 PM
>> To: oplintech at oplin.org
>> Subject: Re: [OPLINTECH] Open Office Software
>>
>> To add a business slant:  I've been exclusively using OOo for 
>> business
>
>> for four+ years now. There's no going back to MS Office or Corel
> Office
>> (both of which I've used extensively in the last ten+ years).
> Especially
>> within OOo Calc (think Excel or Quattro Pro), I can attest to the 
>> completeness of the feature set and compatibility OOo has with MS 
>> Office. OOo is pretty much a no-brainer compared with MS Office.
>>
>> When it comes to the schools and libraries I support, I've been 
>> slowly
>
>> introducing OOo. I think Chauncey's comments about staff adoption are

>> spot-on. Some of the staff take to it right away with no problems. 
>> Others are resistant to change and don't want to take any time at all
> to
>> adjust to a different program, even though the OOo interface is
> similar
>> to that of pre-2007 MS Office.
>>
>> For what it's worth,
>> Chad
>>
>> -----------------------
>> Chad Neeper
>> Senior Systems Engineer
>>
>> Level 9 Networks
>> 740-548-8070 (voice)
>> 866-214-6607 (fax)
>>
>> --   Full LAN/WAN consulting services   --
>> -- Specialized in libraries and schools --
>>
>>
>>
>> shivelri at oplin.org wrote:
>> > Hello, I am the IT Specialist at Greenville Public Library and we
> have
>> > started to use OO for some of our patron and staff computers. I was

>> > curious as to how many other libraries are using OO and what their 
>> > experience has been with it? Do the patrons get along fine with it?

>> > Does the staff?
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
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>>
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